Socrates Bar & Grill
Yoga Symposium.25.0
The Place To Hang After Practice or Exchanges with Other Symposiasts (tympanachus cupido, 1/10/99 4:44:18 PM)If we're gonna be a Symposium, then we'd best have a Greek Bar & Grill with appropriate Hindu, Buddhist and Tantric icons. Watch for the maenads who occasionally come in from the forest to dance here [heh]. Grill is self-serve (remember, Your Mother Doesn't Live Here).
Libation Menu
Juices: Asana Grog (request pre- or post-practice variety &
whinin'about feelin' edgy)
Veggies & Fruits (your call)
Greek Potions: Entheos (you prescribe the dilution)
Other Poisons: Othrorir, Urbock, Mimir's Mead, Vin Mariani, Absinthe, Soma
You Name It - We'll Serve It: Don't be gettin' us in trouble now.Everybody has an open tab - who knows when we'll settle up.
Bring your favorite icons - pics are welcome. Lookin' for the "Beat, Kick & Slap" Iyengar dart board. Bring your least fav guru overlay for the bulls eye. Try not to be too serious or too rowdy - probably not the best place for Savasana but you're welcome to any empty spot on the bar to stretch out to give it a whirl, Movin' Inta Stillness, Sufi style (copy of Rumi behind the bar).
Yeah, you can smoke here but be sure to strap into the smokin' chair 'cause there's a 100 HP! exhaust fan. Bring your own smokes but mind the law now.
Oh yeah. We'll need some grafitti for the yogini's can. Couple those naughty yantras should get us started. And maybe a statue of David (a yogi fer sure) in there with a movable fig leaf that switches a light on over the bar; should be fun gadget with which to torment new patrons and amuse old ones.
Yoga Symposium.25.9
Drink the wine that moves you (tympanachus cupido, 1/12/99 12:18:59 PM)
God has given us a dark wine so potent that,
drinking it, we leave the two worlds.
God has put into the form of hashish the power
to deliver the taster from self-consciousness.
God has made sleep so
that it erases every thought.
God made Majnun love Layla so much that
just her dog would cause confusion in him.
There are thousands of wines
that can take over our minds.
Don't think all ecstasies
are the same!
Jesus was lost in his love for God.
His donkey was drunk with barley.
Drink from the presence of saints,
not from those of other jars.
Every object, every being,
is a jar full of delight.
Be a connoisseur,
and taste with caution.
Any wine will get you high.
Judge like a king, and choose the purest.
The ones unadulterated with fear,
or some urgency about "what's needed."
Drink the wine that moves you
As a camel moves when it's been untied,
and is just ambling about.
--Rumi
I'm just glad SuZ has no dog - the cat confuses me a enough. =8<)[Now (5/2000) the cat has been eaten by the coyotes and the new yoga-dog, Chile, and I are confused.-Ed.]
TopYoga Symposium.25.10
Devin (gardenweasel, 1/15/99 11:32:31 AM)
I'll have a glass of wine, dark and zesty please, with some of that soft, broad in your mouth, cheese, topped with a chile of your choice, my friend.
Yoga Symposium.25.11
Yogamama (Yogamama, 1/15/99 1:57:32 PM)
Got the flu. What do you have for that Bobtender?
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New Mex Big Jim (tympanachus cupido, 1/15/99 5:25:08 PM)
or maybe a Poblano for the weasel with a Cab Port or some Diamond Creek '85 Cab (WOW - now I'm drownin' in my own saliva - take the Cab, it'll put a smile on yer yap). Soft & broad in the mouth, eh? Sure you really want a cheese that'll make ya soft for this sort of righteous occasion? This be The Socs, not Booger King, but you can have it your way, anyway - It's Virtual (notice how, now that we can all almost afford real memory, they've [mostly] quit talking about virtual memory?).
Yogamama got Flu? Bummer! You'll have to sit in the corner by yourself with this 'un (but not over there with the droolers and the icon of Baba G) 'cause we can't have ya makin' the maenads sick. Not the Spanish Flu I hope 'cause we're outta flys.. I usually kill a chicken and paint my chest with the entrails while waiting for the saddhu to light up the dung fired inhaler filled with oil of eucalyptus, cannabis ghee and Muslim toenail clippings (just tell a saddhu to lighten up an' see what happens). But I was given an ahimsa warning and I figger I oughta wait a spell before we be doin' any more bird spells. So, just sit there, whine alot and take a sip (fresh straws, now) of everyone else's libation when they stop by to pat yer noggin or whatever you're presentin' when they holler "Bottoms up!" - bound to feel different soon (hummm, yoga inversion swings are kinda like that; back on topic, ya see?).Yoga Symposium.25.26
Always drink upstream from the herd. (yoga yogi yoda, 2/6/99 11:25:48 AM)
A COWBOY'S GUIDE TO YOGA
Don't squat with your spurs on.
Don't never interfere with something that ain't botherin' you none.
When you give a lesson in meanness to a critter or a person, don't be surprised if they learn their lesson.
If you find yourself in a hole, the first thing to do is stop diggin'.
Timing has a lot to do with the outcome of a rain dance.
The easiest way to eat crow is while it's still warm.
The colder it gets, the harder it is to swaller.
If it don't seem like it's worth the effort, it probably ain't.
It don't take a genius to spot a goat in a flock of sheep.
The biggest troublemaker you'll probably ever have to deal with, watches you shave his face in the mirror every morning.
Never ask a barber if he thinks you need a haircut.
If you get to thinkin' you're a person of some influence, try orderin' somebody else's dog around.
Don't worry about bitin' off more'n you can chew. Your mouth is probably a whole lot bigger'n you think.
Always drink upstream from the herd.
Generally, you ain't learnin' nothin' when your mouth is a-jawin'.
Good judgment comes from experience, and a lotta that comes from bad judgment.
Generally speakin', fancy titles and nightshirts are a waste of time.
If you're ridin' ahead of the herd, take a look back every now and then to make sure it's still there.
If you're gonna go...go like hell. If your mind's not made up, don't use your spurs.
Never kick a fresh cowpie on a hot day.
Never drop your gun to hug a grizzly.
When you're throwin' your weight around, be ready to have it thrown around by somebody else.
Lettin' the cat outta the bag is a whole lot easier 'n puttin' it back.
Always take a good look at what you're about to eat. It's not so important to know what it is, but it's critical to know what it was.
Never miss a good chance to shutup. (Often good advice for symposiasts. Scroll up if you have landed here from a link and/or are bewildered. This is the last line of advice in a way cool Cowboy's Guide to Yoga. -Ed.)Yoga Symposium.25.141
(Shakti Das, 7/2/99 9:03:09 PM)Yes, all is not perfect in India and the dichotomies are very striking, yet I found peace not trying to figure it out in the head, being critical, or trying to solve India's problem for them (tendencies that I eventually found best to abandon).
Perhaps the greatest dichotomy is how admidst right brain India, widespread godess worship, and Indira Gandhi popularity, the traditional subservience and exploitation of women co-exists. The disparities between men and women are even more extreme in the poor and in the rural areas and one rarely sees an India woman traveling on a train alone. They do the heaviest and hardest work and have the least privileges and are expected to wear traditional Indian garb, but not the men. Again in the large cities, this is rapidly changing where you will actually see some liberated Indian women wearing Levis!
SO for a Western woman traveling alone, this can be a big problem (most Western women are judged by the movies and TV shows as loose women). If however you travel with someone else, there is far less of a chance that you will be so addressed.
Of course there are many more dichotomies in India than the disparity between the two sexes, but perhaps that is the "worse" one! The entire country used to be entirely laid back, but the automobile has greatly changed that. In general the north is much more hassled than the South. Bihar state especially may be the most violence prone, yet I wound up spending over a month there visiting Bihar School of Yoga, The Root Institute, Nalanada University, Rajgir (where the Buddha lived and meditated for many years), and Bodhigaya (where the Buddha became enlightened). So even Bihar (India's poorest, most anarchial, and most violent state) has some of the most incredible power spots -- and so the dichotomies of India deepen until acceptance of India (and her mystery) becomes natural -- it's India after all.
I liked Ann Cushman's book and its sense of humour. She captures its mood well and its a good preparation, other than to say that the "real" India happens organically, after we have laid aside all our plans and impositions upon her. Just like an alleyway that we have walked past for aeons suddenly reveals to us a windowed view to the highest Himalayan peak that was always there but hidden by our preconceptions.
Oh well -- the actual yoga academies and ashrams are at best a starting place while underneath that there is a tremendous depth of adventure that awaits us in the heart.
There was not any one place that I found that I could really recommend. The North is cold in Winter and the high Himalaya only accessible in Summer (while the rest of India is steaming). Most Westerners arrive between early October (at the end of the monsoons) and leave by March or April (Hot), but there is indeed reasons to travel (to the Himalayas and Ladakh) in Summer.
India has wonderful fruit (peel the skin carefully or soak the fruit in a pail that has sufficient iodine or chlorine bleach antiseptic for a half hour. I did this during grape season in maharasthra (didn't get sick). The yogurt is also fantastic if you buy it fresh daily (a kilogram or two) straight from the local dairy. On the other hand, I couln't tolerate the standard fair of cooked grains, vegetables, spices, tea, and oils.
The South, Chinnai (Madras), Mysore, Auroville, Pondicherry, Kerala, and Karnataka (such as Bangalore and Mysore) are perhaps the most colorful (Rajastan is colorful also) and the most friendly (at the present). Each state has their own language or two, but English will suffice (although I did wish that I spoke Hindi many times). There is much yoga there (in the South) although I wouldn't expect that much from established or well known places.
Like anywhere, its not always clear what to do, like the Indians can be very hospitable, giving, and sharing )mostly in the South); yet also there do exist thieves and vamps ( mostly in the North). However when grace opens up to you in India, it's often quite clear and amazing!
So now you know why I order green tea chai lattes with reduced fat chocolate soy milk -- oh well that's an"other" story ...
Namaste!
donnyYoga Symposium.25.181
Kit Spahr (Kit Spahr, 10/15/99 8:24:17 AM)I think maybe in the beginning you have to learn someone else's yoga. But as you progress you look around at all the choices and maybe dabble in several. I was at that point when I read Erich's book and then did a short workshop with him. I went with high hopes but I'd been disappointed before. Thinking maybe this would be the person I'd really connect with.
Well I did connect but not in the way I'd imagined. It was so much better than I'd imagined. What I learned, even in those three short days was to find, not Erich's yoga, but MY yoga. I can't tell you exactly how he did it. But it was a gift I'm immensely thankful for.
Kit
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kevin wood (sahaj, 10/15/99 9:45:33 PM)How I found my own practice was to finally trust that the source of the yoga wisdom is inside of me rather than the dogmatic following of another's interpretation. It isn't so much a piecing together of the fragments of Krishnamacharia's teachings but to source the foundational principles. Krishnamacharia was only one teacher, and there are so many interpretations and other teaching lineages out there, and he must have had his own interpretation of his teacher's path.
The limiting of oneself to following the path of one teacher could be important for awhile but sooner or later you have to leave the nest....But how to do this? Start by trusting that you know deeply what is right for you. There are no rules or set vinyasas that have to be followed. Aligment is very subjective so don't get bogged down in that either. I found that when I finally trusted that I knew what was right for me from moment to moment then I "owned" the yoga. Before, it owned me so to speak, because I had to many fixed notions about what it should look like.
Take the leap...... Scary but liberating... You don't need a teacher to tell you anything just go inside and trust. [ and look at a few books for ideas on sequencing, breathing etc..].
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fixing things... (ksalo, 11/23/99 6:59:20 AM)I've been reading Pema Chödrön's book, (When things fall apart) and there's one thing I'd like to understand a little better. She talks about abandoning hope in being able to fix one's life. According to her we try to live our lives according to our own and the society's expectations, and most often this fails, one way or another. Things fall apart - marriages crumble, careers, health, anything can go wrong. But we're constantly struggling to fix our lives. We expect to be able to one day find the combination of the lock that will open our lives so that we'll have no problems anymore. Chödrön says that we have to abandon hope on getting this fix. For my part, I know that I did give up hope at certain point in my life. After that good things started coming my way, like yoga. What I am wondering about right now is the people around me who are still engaged in getting their lives fixed. I know it does not help them to say "abandon hope" ' cause they have to realise that in their hearts, not in their head. For me realising that there's no hope of fixing my life was very, very painful and took a long time. It is a process that I wouldn't actually recommend anyone. So, finally, my question is: is it possible to grow into abandoning hope gradually, smoothly? Through meditation and yoga? I only found yoga after I abandoned hope, so i'm asking could the transition be smoother?
The people who try to fix their lives fight a losing battle. For them, someone who's given up fighting seems like someone who has (in a way) won. And they're eager to know how to pull that out. But if I tell them abandon hope of being able to fix your life, they'll add it into their pack of tricks to fix their lives. In a way, anything that makes people feel even a tiny bit more comfortable, just buys them a little more time at the side of the hopeful. But getting to where there's no hope, that would mean facing all the discomfort of one's life. That's just too tough. I'd like to know some way of helping them, but the only real help is just letting go of one's expectations and facing what is. All people are able to give up struggling for a little while, like when viewing a spectacular sunset - in some circumstances the struggle just falls off. Most people use this as a welcome recharge of batteries to fight even harder to have a " good" life.
I don't know if what I'm saying makes any sense, but I'd be interested if anyone has any comments.
-Kristiina
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Bob Cox (tympanachus cupido, 11/23/99 10:09:18 AM)>>What I am wondering about right now is the people around me who are still engaged in getting their lives fixed.<<
Seems to me this is where the rub usually hangs with high friction. The closer they are to you, the likelier they are to involve you in the "fix." Somehow they often perceive you as the part that needs fixing. Could be they're often right - in their own context, at least. Contracts, particularly social ones, are an endless series of amendments.
I do know that most people, especially ourselves, are hard to help. Best to help only when asked unless we're responsible (ourselves, our kids, aging parents, sick mates...) and then we should work hard to make it be a joint effort.
I really think Chodron's message (I've merely skimmed the book) is like Erich's: stop making decisions on the assumption that you have the best data and processes; let Infinite Mind be heard, however poorly, to find the path of least pain and most reward. I find no problem in living the present with the past and future in perspective. Take care of yourself today (mind-body-spirit fitness) to ensure tomorrow brings a prospect of equal or greater merit than yesterday.
Avoiding the "herd" seems to help. If you're into yoga, you're probably avoiding the herd in spiritual matters and that's a good start on minimizing the opportunity to become involved in other's need for the fix.
The only thing you can really "do" is to cultivate the following virtues:
Honesty (Breeds trust and confidence, especially when it come to feelings, sex and mistakes.)
Respect (Behave appropriately and expect it; give it when it's due. Don't make gender a discriminator.)
Commitment (Time, effort and patience; demand reciprocation.)
Ask For Help (It doesn't feel so much like criticism if you ask for it.)
Tolerance (Learn to disagree agreeably. Don't sweat the small stuff.)
"Does it work for you, Bobby," you ask?
Not very well and I'm not sure if it's emotions or intellect that gets in the way. Could be it's hubris. Could be I'm still trying to swim upstream to the herd on that old river Fix.
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Kristiina Salo (ksalo, 2/6/00 6:38:12 AM)Hello folks, Back from India, I was one month in Kovalam Beach in Lino Miele workshop, and one month in Mysore - first a week's workshop with Sharath and then three weeks at the Lakshmipuram school where Pattabhi Jois and Sharath teach. Very interesting trip. Right now it feels that the biggest thing that I got was that I got connected to getting "forward" with my practice. I know I'm treading dangerous ground - I do not mean that focus on progress is central in yoga. But for me, i had almost forgotten about it. When practicing by myself, I am happy with putting in less effort than I could afford. I had no faith in being able to do more than I've previously done. In Mysore I was very impressed with the way beginners were treated: Guruji and Sharath really showed faith in their ability to progress. Or that was how I experienced it. And that affected me also. If they can have faith in people who have a hard time with even the easy postures, why wouldn't I have a little bit of faith in my ability to do things I haven't been able to do before? Then there's also the energy thing, but that's harder to talk about. I found it very easy to connect to the bliss, the pleasure of doing yoga when I was there. Maybe it's the warmer climate, energy, whatever. I hope to be able to sustain it now that I'm back home.
One thing I was left chewing was (I think) Donny's comment about how different styles of yoga mold people into different shapes. I have always thought that different disciplines do that - the martial arts, dancing, whatever - all mold bodies in certain directions. But in yoga - if we are striving for balance, is there some optimum for that? Iyengar yoga body type is different from astanga body type, but is that any kind of indication about whether the practice is beneficial or not? My own body has definitely been molded, but is that good or bad, I do not know. Yoga just seems to be a very effective in changing the body. It would be interesting to know how y'all relate to this.
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Kit Spahr (Kit Spahr, 2/6/00 11:02:13 AM)Kristiina: How did Sharath and Guruji manifest their faith in the beginners ability to progress? I'm curious because sometimes I think that I don't have that faith... sometimes beginners seem to resist progress...it seems to be a resistance of the mind that manifests in the body. I'm not sure how to help them get past that resistance.
I'm also interested in the Lino Miele workshop...not for me so much but my husband will be doing a 3 day workshop with him in Chicago this summer...and I'd like to pass along your impressions to him.
We have two friends currently in Mysore. So far only sketchy reports but they will definitely returned changed. In what ways? It remains to be seen!
Kit
Yoga Symposium.25.247
Good question... (ksalo, 2/7/00 2:05:29 AM)I know the attitude one tends to have towards beginners, especially the ones who show no signs of making a sincere effort at doing the stuff. In Mysore, there was a person who did the series only to janu shirsasana C, and after that utpluthee. Sharath had to lift her knees to get her off the ground. Somehow that hit me big time. Those people, they could make beginners feel like dirt, and nobody would blame them. But they do not. Likewise, in the " Symposiums" in the afternoons where people can ask questions, Guruji sincerely answers even the stupidest questions. There's great humility in accepting everyone exactly as they are. I don't know how to do that myself. Looking at beginners, I think - oh, no, how are they ever going to get along? I kinda expect them to prove themselves, which of course the more insecure people can feel. I'll have to think about this a little more, maybe I'll be able to say something more understandable when I've chewed on this a while.
Kristiina
Yoga Symposium.25.248
kevin wood (sahaj, 2/8/00 2:06:38 PM)Kristina, welcome back. Mysore is a wonderfull place, and I agree with you that Guruji is a very caring and sincere person.
My feeling is that the outer shape of the body is unimportant and the overall balance of energetics is critical in asessing the value of a particular sadhana. But the male oriented systems of Iengar and Ashtanga, (remember they were both taught as young boys this vinyasa ) create male bodies. Have you seen madonna lately?
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Kit Spahr (Kit Spahr, 2/9/00 8:53:04 AM)Hmmmm...interesting observation Kevin...re: the male body shaping. But then isn't that the body type that so many women in the west are seeking?
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Kristiina Salo (ksalo, 2/10/00 1:26:08 AM)Forgot to answer Kit on Lino - He's the "head" teacher of the finnish astanga people. I started with him, and I consider myself his student, as probably all finns who have been doing this yoga for a while. So, obviously, I like him. But his style might differ from what Americans are used to. So, I hope your husband (was it husband?) likes the workshop.
Regarding the bodyshape - haven't seen Madonna lately, but I can look at the mirror. And even Indian god-figures - they have narrow hips and broad shoulders. I find the changes in my body interesting, but somehow I do not identify myself very strongly with my body. If I think about balance, I know that i used to be - like women generally are - flexible but weak. Now with yoga my flexibility has improved very much and I have gained some strength. I think that emphasizing just flexibility doesn't make a balanced practice. A practice that develops strength seems to make hips narrower and arms more muscular. Is that good or bad? I don't even know what balance actually means in this context. Because if it simply means strength and flexibility in equal measure, then being very flexible but weak (as some people are) would be as bad as being very stiff and also strong. But in yoga we tend to admire flexibility, and consider those who can do difficult asanas more advanced.
I have a vague recollection of a parable about snake Ananta, the first yogi, whose body was curled up to act as cushion for god (Vishnu?) and carries the world on it's head. If that's the aim - to be soft enough to be a cushion for god, strong enough to carry the world on one's head, that means great strength and great softness. How will this manifest in the body - or mind? Kevin says astanga is geared to build male body - what kind of sadhana builds female body? Is there some difference there, and what is it if there would be one?
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kevin wood (sahaj, 2/10/00 12:46:01 PM)Kit, You are right that the latest trend is the denial of the female in many ways body shape being a reflection of this general trend towards the pragmatism, materialism , etc. of the modern world. Even here in Australia, softness has given way to a right wing economic rationalist government and all that goes with an imbalanced way of perceiving the world.
Kristina is right that we must have balance between flexibility and strength that must be a reflection of the eternal dance of the male and female principles of life. Osho used to say of mr. Iyengar that he was creating male energy and that it wasn't good for women to practice this way. But their are some women who are more male and some men who are more female in essence, so it wouldn't be fair to say that was true for every woman. As far as ashtanga goes, and I know that I won't be heard by those who are attached to that form, it does create a very male energetics and if that is what you want to create then there is no problem. But if you want more softness, openess, and nurturing in your life, (which is what the world needs more of) then it doesn't work for that purpose. The main thing seems to be that we are aware of what the practice is doing to us objectively ane experiencialy not dogmatically.
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Brad (ashtangaboy, 3/6/00 2:41:09 PM)Same here. I think this is just a really cool thing. I know I hit and miss on my posts, but it is really cool how people can read them and say I think this is what your saying or something. To be honest, this site is a real tribute to Erich Schiffmann. His reputation alone is the reason why I think a lot of people place a lot of trust into this site. I have shared some aspects of my life that I would have not even thought about sharing on some other forum or to people around my local area.
I think reading his book helps. He never places you in a position where you have to take his word. Its like this is what I have found works during a, b, and, c. Test it to see if its true for you.
He forces you to try to make him earn his trust. A cool attribute for a teacher as far as I'm concerned.
Namaste, Brad
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Yea Erich! (suz coyote, 3/6/00 3:49:33 PM)Yes, Brad, yes! You've captured Erich. He's a sweet and wonderful teacher. He is THE reason that Bob (Yup.-Ed.) got interested in yoga and that I recommitted.
Three cheers for the surfin' yoga dude.
Namaste, Namaste, Namaste!
SuZ
Yoga Conference.56.30
Conscious Plants? (tympanachus cupido, 3/17/00 7:51:27 AM)
Physical form is a good place to be, yes mam. The alternative worries me a bit from time to time - I'm struggling with the subtle diff between soul and spirit at the moment.Here's a simple graph of Wilber's emerging model for homo sapiens; if anyone would like to dip their toe in (click on the graph for a short [for Wilber] explanatory text):
If you regard the mind with its conscious component as a component the soul and the spark of life as spirit, then what should you think about plants; spiritual structures without soul?
Dale Pendell thinks we may have gotten consciousness from plants; mobility, perhaps, is then a gift we have given back to those plants. I recommend his Moon Medicine/Sun Medicine treatise. He sez, "The lunar mercury dissolves immensities - it is yoga, not philosophy."
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Erich Schiffmann (schiffmann, 3/21/00 11:57:07 PM)
Bob, why do you think plants do not have a conscious component?
We're building a small yoga room in our back yard. I'll finally have a great place to practice. I'm thrilled.
Namaste all!
Erich
Yoga Conference.56.33
Great news, Erich... (tympanachus cupido, 3/22/00 9:59:47 AM)
...the Yoga Room!
Betcha there's not gonna be a phone jack there and portables/beepers will be checked at the door with the shoes. Some music though I 'spect and probably some things that smell good, a variety of eye candy (maybe even a DVD player/Flat Panel CRT?) and an icon or two. Mirrors? What kinda floors, props, environemental controls and lighting? Got a drawing & specs together you'd be willing to share?
>>Bob, why do you think plants do not have a conscious component? <<Here's what I'm currently thinking about the spectrum of consciousness for "animated" elements within the electromagnetic spectrum that Homo s. uses to sample consensus reality. Pardon my taxonomy:
Some mushroom mycelial nets are the largest organisms on and within Gaea (that we know about) - the really big ones are represented in the red area of my plants column - and may, by sheer density/magnitude of interconnections, offer some benchmark for consciousness.
Finally, one has to say what is meant by consciousness (and soul). It has to be be viewed (by immersion, perhaps) from the perspective of elementary particles and quantum mechanical models and from the perspective of mega-macro aggregates such as celestial bodies.
Awareness seems to be an indicator of consciousness and perhaps by that measure the extent of homo sapiens' consciousness would be more than 2 orders of magnitude on the scale above.
Wilber may have sorted out some of this with his exploration of Intergral Psychology - this might be a good next step into the daylight (or the ocean), you might say...
To answer your question [finally], I'm not clear on just where I think "soul" appears in the continuum of consciousness. The easy answer I suppose is "everywhere." I'm not a "plant man" (like Pendell) though I revere my dietary and general environmental relationships (carbon dioxide/oxygen/photosynthesis/ esthetic) with them. Out of hubris I think I'd arbitrarily pencil in a wavy horizontal soul line at about the 100 level (dogs have soul).Yoga Symposium.25.285
Erich Schiffmann (schiffmann, 3/6/00 5:27:30 PM)Thanks, folks! And believe it or not, I'm here more than it may seem. I enjoy reading all the posts but don't always feel moved to say anything myself.
My first girlfriend died on Friday of cancer. She had been struggling with it for about ten years. I flew up to San Francisco and saw her on Thursday night for about two hours. She was just skin and bones with big cancerous growths coming out of her body in two places. She was on a morphine drip so she was sort of out of it, though we could talk and she knew I was there. I saw her again Friday morning. Mostly we didn't say much, she lying there with eyes half open. I left at noon and flew home. When I got home there was a message on the phone machine from the caretaker saying she had died half an hour after I left. It was perfect. She waited to say goodbye.
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Kit Spahr (Kit Spahr, 3/6/00 6:59:45 PM)Erich, how wonderful you were able to say good bye. I'm not surprised she waited. My mother waited until 15 minutes after my brother and I arrived...my father was alone in the house and she waited for us to get there. My other brother died in his sleep hours after I left his house for a visit. He had been up and around...we talked for hours then I left to go to my father's house two hours away. My brother's last words to me were "I wish we had more time". I thought he meant just that particular visit.
If yoga hadn't taught me this, death of loved ones would have...there is another kind of knowing.
This website has been and remains a wonderful place to visit and participate in. I've seen other yoga discussions which are nasty, rude, competitive. This one has a lot of class...and a lot of caring. Cyberspace can be weird but somehow we seem to have transcended that here.
Thanks
Kit
Yoga Conference.25.287
The best of the web (YogaSuz, 3/6/00 7:35:24 PM)>>This website has been and remains a wonderful place to visit and participate in. I've seen other yoga discussions which are nasty, rude, competitive. This one has a lot of class...and a lot of caring. Cyberspace can be weird but somehow we seem to have transcended that here.<<
Yes, I agree, we have a great thing here in this community. I have a good friend who is active in many online communities and he was shocked when I said that we had no people who came on and just were mean to be mean. Apparently this is extremely common on online boards. Here, we have a great discussion, great debates, sometimes "spirited" but never mean-spirited.But, you know, that is why I love yoga, because almost everyone in it is kind, compassionate, thoughtful, counter-culture but not out of touch with reality. I think our little community here represents what I love about the people who do yoga.
It's true cyberspace can be weird and sometimes it is hard to deal with that. I have to admit that going to Erich's workshop was a strange experience. I was worried what Erich would think I was a cyberstalker weirdo and he was probably wondering if I was a cyberstalker weirdo. Once we got over that, though, I felt very easy sitting and talking with him.
One thing that makes us unique as a community is that many of us have met Erich. For me, this takes away some of the fear that people are misrepresenting themselves online.The words here belong to the writers - please provide attribution if quoted on other web sites or in other media. These excerpts have been selected and edited for clarity by the editor. --R. Cox
